Beskrivelse:
I read on the Netfugl website there have seen two (different?) <b>Pallid Harriers</b> in male 2cy plumage in Denmark in August 2005.
Since we discovered a bird (1 sept) in Outgaarden, Belgium that several ornithologists determined as a Pallid Harrier 2cy male, there has been a lot of discussion.
A 2cy male hen harrier is still not excluded by some. This plumage (brown upperparts, P9 and P10 still juvenile, rest of primaries are changed, secondaries mostly still juvenile (only 3 new adult ones), headpattern visible, ...) seems very rare for pallid as well as for hen harrier.
There are also some doubts about the general structure of the bird, especially the wing bases.
Therefore we are looking for descriptions (and if possible photos, even bad ones) of 2 cy summer and autumn males. Can you help us further with the two recent records in Denmark?
Important to know (and invisible on pics):
- bird is as small as black crow
- head pattern (collar + long light patch above and small patch under the eye) is clearly visible
- long projection of tail (when sitting on ground)
- very pale tail (merges on top with short very white and unbarred rump) without any visible barring
The biggest issue at the moment is the general structure of the bird that tends more to 2 calender year male Hen Harrier, unless plumage details that tends to Pallid Harrier.
Thanks and best regards,
Freek Verdonckt
Dear Luc and others
I noticed the name of this bird on this very web has chanced recently. I suspect you have something to do with this somehow.
I’m still a little perplexed. If you read this, maybe you can explain how, if so, you now identify it as montagu´s – maybe you have more pics you can post or link to.
Best regards
Troels
Dear Troels, Luc and others,
It was due to a mistake made by one of the administrators at Netfugl that the bird suddenly was named Montagu's Harrier. Netfugl got an email from Luc that the bird was in fact a Hen Harrier!
Cheers, Jens
Jens Søgaard Hansen
www.Netfugl.dk
Please note the text and the photos were sent by Freek Verdonckt,the discoverer of the bird,not me.
The bird was first labelled as a second-calendar year male Pallid Harrier,but some observers had doubts about the identification.Unfortunately,the bird was only seen for short times and at great distance.
At the fifth day, I went to see the bird and try to photograph it (there were still no photographs). During a wait of 4 hours, I saw the bird for 20 seconds at a distance of 300 meters…
So don't shoot the pianist.
Luc,
So sorry to unintentionally (of cause) dragging the “pianist” into this. Your big effort documenting the Harrier, which might have contributed to convince somebody it was a Hen, are indeed honorable.
Best regards,
Troels
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Beskrivelse:
I read on the Netfugl website there have seen two (different?) <b>Pallid Harriers</b> in male 2cy plumage in Denmark in August 2005.
Since we discovered a bird (1 sept) in Outgaarden, Belgium that several ornithologists determined as a Pallid Harrier 2cy male, there has been a lot of discussion.
A 2cy male hen harrier is still not excluded by some. This plumage (brown upperparts, P9 and P10 still juvenile, rest of primaries are changed, secondaries mostly still juvenile (only 3 new adult ones), headpattern visible, ...) seems very rare for pallid as well as for hen harrier.
There are also some doubts about the general structure of the bird, especially the wing bases.
Therefore we are looking for descriptions (and if possible photos, even bad ones) of 2 cy summer and autumn males. Can you help us further with the two recent records in Denmark?
Important to know (and invisible on pics):
- bird is as small as black crow
- head pattern (collar + long light patch above and small patch under the eye) is clearly visible
- long projection of tail (when sitting on ground)
- very pale tail (merges on top with short very white and unbarred rump) without any visible barring
The biggest issue at the moment is the general structure of the bird that tends more to 2 calender year male Hen Harrier, unless plumage details that tends to Pallid Harrier.
Thanks and best regards,
Freek Verdonckt
Beskrivelse:
I read on the Netfugl website there have seen two (different?) <b>Pallid Harriers</b> in male 2cy plumage in Denmark in August 2005.
Since we discovered a bird (1 sept) in Outgaarden, Belgium that several ornithologists determined as a Pallid Harrier 2cy male, there has been a lot of discussion.
A 2cy male hen harrier is still not excluded by some. This plumage (brown upperparts, P9 and P10 still juvenile, rest of primaries are changed, secondaries mostly still juvenile (only 3 new adult ones), headpattern visible, ...) seems very rare for pallid as well as for hen harrier.
There are also some doubts about the general structure of the bird, especially the wing bases.
Therefore we are looking for descriptions (and if possible photos, even bad ones) of 2 cy summer and autumn males. Can you help us further with the two recent records in Denmark?
Important to know (and invisible on pics):
- bird is as small as black crow
- head pattern (collar + long light patch above and small patch under the eye) is clearly visible
- long projection of tail (when sitting on ground)
- very pale tail (merges on top with short very white and unbarred rump) without any visible barring
The biggest issue at the moment is the general structure of the bird that tends more to 2 calender year male Hen Harrier, unless plumage details that tends to Pallid Harrier.
Thanks and best regards,
Freek Verdonckt
Fandt denne fugl under "Hedehøg". Det synes jeg ikke helt den ligner. I Luc Verrokens kommentarer spekuleres i Steppehøg eller Blå Kærhøg.
Fuglen er klar en 2K han, der fortsat har yderste juvenile (blegede og lyse) håndsvingfjer og indslag af juvenile armsvingfjer.
Oversiden ser ret mørk ud, som man tit ser det hos Blå Kærhøg, ligesom de mørke spidser på de nye inderste håndsvingfjer peger i den retning. Den ret afstikkende hvide overgump afviser ikke Blå kærhøg.
Jeg opfatter hånden som ret bred, hvilket igen passer fint med blå kærhøg, kontra Steppehøgens slankere hånd.
The bird in question is labelled as "Montagu´S Harrier", which probably is wrong. The choise is between Pallid and Hen Harrier.
It is a 2. cal. year male, showing pale and bleached juvenile outer primaries and a good number of unmoulted juvenile secondaries.
The overall shape, including the rather broad hand, is good for Hen. Also, the dark tips to the new inner primaries, the rather contrasting white rump and the rather dark mantle suggests this species. A similar aged Pallid should show a narrower and more pointed hand, no clear dark tips to new inner primaries and probably never as dark mantle as this bird. Allthough identifying birds from few images is not always easy, the bird looks like a 2. cal year Hen Harrier.
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